Discussion:
#Do Teabaggers understand the Constitution?
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Zepp
2013-05-11 21:28:55 UTC
Permalink
May 11, 2013
Does the Tea Party understand the Constitution?
The Right constantly claims devotion to our founding documents. The
problem: Its policies completely violate them
By John D'Amico
Does the Tea Party understand the Constitution?
Rand Paul, Michele Bachmann (Credit: Reuters/Jonathan Ernst/AP/Stacy
Bengs)
Last month, 20 House Republicans, along with staffers from nearly 40
congressional offices attended the first meeting of the Congressional Tea
Party Caucus. The three premises behind the Caucus, according to Rep.
Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.), who emceed the event, are “we’re taxed
enough, we spend less than we take in, and we follow the Constitution.”
This purported devotion to the founding documents echoes the themes
reverberated at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) in
March, where Sarah Palin and former Rick Santorum declared that the
Declaration of Independence has given America “a set of principles and
values” — and Senator Rand Paul (R-Ky.) urged his party to respect the
individual “by going forward to the classical and timeless ideas
enshrined in our Constitution.”
Naturally, these pronouncements raise a fundamental question — namely,
which governmental policies and programs are consistent with the core
values and ideals of the Declaration of Independence and the
Constitution? Are they the ones proposed by the Tea Party and
conservatives? The Declaration of Independence proclaims that: “We hold
these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal; that
they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights; that
among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. That to
secure these rights governments are instituted among men …” Slavery
having been abolished and women enfranchised, Thomas Jefferson’s powerful
words should be read to mean that all human beings are by nature equal as
persons.
A student of classic Greek philosophy, Jefferson may have derived this
insight from Plato: “All men are by nature equal, made all of the same
earth by the same Workman, and however we deceive ourselves, as dear to
God is the poor peasant as the mighty prince.” All people have rights
inherent in their human nature including life, liberty, and the pursuit
of happiness. We all have bodies and brains. Although some people are
smarter, better looking or more physically fit than others, we all need
food, water, clothing and shelter to survive. But the mere satisfaction
of our physical needs is not our ultimate goal. Our founding fathers
learned from Aristotle that “happiness is the meaning and purpose of
life, the whole aim and end of human existence.” It is a whole life well-
lived and enriched by the cumulative possession of all the goods —
health, sufficient wealth, knowledge, friendship and virtue — that a
moral and ethical human being ought to desire.
Accordingly, John Adams believed “the happiness of society is the end of
government.” Jefferson agreed, declaring that “the care of human life and
happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate
object of good government.” The pursuit of happiness is dependent on, and
calls for, governmental protection of our life and health. Viewed through
the prism of the Declaration, then, universal background checks for gun
purchases, health care reform legislation to cover the uninsured, child
care, workplace safety, laws and regulations protecting the air we
breathe and the water we drink, and measures to slow or reverse global
warming that science tells us is threatening the health of our planet and
its human inhabitants, are essential to protect our right to life and
abet our pursuit of happiness.
Conservative Republican and Tea Party senators and representatives want
to block, weaken, or abolish these programs even though they are
consistent with the principles of the Declaration of Independence and the
objectives of the Constitution, the Preamble of which includes ideals
that were embedded in the Declaration: “We, the people of the United
States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure
domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general
welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our
posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United
States of America.” Implicit in the Preamble is the assertion that no
society in which we would want to live can exist without justice, civil
peace, welfare and liberty. Toward these ends, Article One, Section 8 of
the Constitution gives Congress the power “to lay and collect taxes,
duties, imposts, and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common
defense and general welfare of the United States.”
The “general welfare” is an element in the common good that the
government was created to serve. The critical question is how much should
the government do to serve the common good and thereby secure for its
citizens life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness? The Republican
“Pledge to America” argues that Congress has ignored “the proper limits
imposed by the Constitution.” It demands that the size of government be
reduced, spending slashed, and taxes curtailed. The Tea Party “Contract
from America” maintains that the “purpose of government should be limited
to the protection of our liberties by administering justice and insuring
our safety.” It asserts that government should not venture beyond these
functions or attempt to increase its power over the marketplace and the
economic decisions of individuals. These views echo the platform of the
Libertarian Party, which emphasizes individual liberty in personal and
economic affairs without interference from government. Libertarians place
the highest value on liberty, and they want an unlimited amount of
freedom even if the result is that some citizens are impoverished.
It must be remembered, however, that one of the purposes of the
government according to the Constitution is to “establish justice.”
Alexander Hamilton once asked, “Why has government been instituted at
all?” His answer: “Because the passions of men will not conform to the
dictates of reason and justice without constraint.” The Dodd-Frank Wall
Street Reform Act regulating financial markets and creating the Consumer
Finance Protection Bureau in the wake of the Great Recession of 2009, the
implementation of which is being stymied by banks and financial
institutions and their conservative supporters in Congress, is a perfect
illustration of Hamilton’s point. Only when it is understood and agreed
that greed at the harmful expense of others is not good — a concept not
yet grasped by Wall Street and our representatives in Washington — will
reason and justice prevail. Implicit in our founding documents and in the
thinking of our founding fathers is the principle that there should be a
balance between liberty and equality. Thomas Jefferson expressed it this
way: “rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will
within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others.”
How, then, should we resolve the conflict between the extremist
proponents of liberty and equality? Conservative 20th century philosopher
and educator Mortimer Adler proposed a definitive formula for achieving
the appropriate balance in his 1981 book, “Six Great Ideas.” The nation’s
founders, he wrote, recognized that “neither liberty nor equality is the
prime value, that neither is an unlimited good, and that both can be
maximized harmoniously only when regulated by justice.” We should have
only as much liberty as justice allows, and society should strive for
only as much equality of conditions as justice requires. The economic
inequality that justice allows “consists in some having more wealth than
anyone needs … but since the amount of wealth available for distribution
is limited, no one should be in a position to earn by his productive
contribution — to earn, not to steal or seize — so much wealth that not
enough remains for distribution, in one way or another, to put all
individuals on the base line of economic sufficiency.”
In other words, justice requires that no individual or family be
“seriously deprived, by destitution or dire poverty, of that minimal
supply of economic goods that everyone needs … To this much everyone has
a natural right.” Adler maintained that “the pursuit of happiness is our
primary obligation.” He added, however, that we are also obligated to do
what is right with regard to others and to the community. This is not a
new concept, as one discovers when reading Jefferson’s version of the
Bible (Matthew 25:34-36, New King James Version), which consisted only of
the words of Jesus:

Then the King will say to those on his right hand, “Come, you blessed
of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of
the world: for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you
gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; I was naked and you
clothed Me; I was sick and you looked after Me; I was in prison and you
came to Me … Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of
the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.”

We have enacted these precepts into law in the form of public assistance,
food stamps, meals on wheels, low-income housing aid, heating assistance,
income tax credits and other forms of help for those who have slipped
below the poverty line or are seriously disabled. Regrettably,
conservative Republicans and Tea Partiers have forced Congress to slash
most of these social safety net programs in the belief that economic
rights are not guaranteed in the Declaration of Independence and
Constitution.
It is true that economic rights were not a central concern in an 18th
century society of self-sufficient farmers, artisans and slave
plantations. By the beginning of the 20th century, however, the abolition
of slavery and the Industrial Revolution had totally transformed America.
The mass production of a wide variety of goods raised the standard of
living for a growing middle class. It also created a large class of low-
paid workers struggling to subsist in squalid urban tenements. These
conditions prompted President Theodore Roosevelt to recognize in 1910
that “the object of the government is the welfare of the people” and that
the economic well being of laborers must be protected:

No man can be a good citizen unless he has a wage more than
sufficient to cover the bare cost of living and hours of labor short
enough so that after his day’s work is done he will have time and energy
to bear his share in the management of the community, to help in carrying
the general load. We keep countless men from being good citizens by the
conditions of life with which we surround them.

In his message to Congress in 1944, President Franklin D. Roosevelt
declared that “true individual freedom cannot exist without economic
security and independence … People who are hungry and out of a job are
the stuff of which dictatorships are made …” He urged Congress to
implement various economic rights — to a useful and remunerative job,
adequate food and shelter, a decent home, adequate medical care, a good
education, and protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness,
accident and unemployment. Government programs that secure and implement
these rights such as Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Unemployment
Insurance, and federal funding to reform education, assist students,
create jobs, boost energy efficiency, and repair the nation’s
infrastructure — all under attack by the far Right, are consistent with
the purposes and objectives of the Declaration of Independence and the
Constitution. These programs, along with all of the others mentioned in
this article, safeguard our “inalienable rights” to “life, liberty and
the pursuit of happiness.” They also “form a more perfect union,”
establish “justice,” promote “the general welfare,” and secure “the
blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity.”
Unfortunately, we are still far from realizing these ideals of democracy.
One in five Americans is unemployed or underemployed. More than 46
million people are living in poverty, and another 20 million barely
subsist on Social Security. Over 1.5 million are homeless, and one in
seven mortgages is in default or foreclosure. More than 17 million
children lack the means to get enough nutritious food on a regular basis.
Over 48 million lack health insurance. These needy persons can expect
little relief from conservative Republican and Tea Party representatives
and senators who promise to stop “out of control spending” and reduce the
size of government while at the same time insisting that the richest
Americans and hugely profitable corporations continue to benefit from low
effective rates of taxation and tax loopholes. Why? Because the wealthy
individuals and anonymous organizations that support this agenda pour
hundreds of millions of dollars into Congressional campaigns, and special
corporate and industrial interests dedicate billions of dollars to
lobbying.
The rich and super-rich who call the shots in Washington are not elected
members of what Abraham Lincoln called our “government of the people, by
the people, for the people.” They have not taken an oath to preserve and
defend the Constitution. Yet, they exercise immense political power and
have aborted and emasculated government programs on which millions of
Americans depend for their survival. To prevent this political misuse of
wealth, justice requires such reforms as public funding of electoral
campaigns, shortening of the campaign season and assuring candidates
equal time on television. To secure political liberty, justice requires
an electoral system that does not impose unreasonable and unnecessary
impediments to the right to vote, such as overly burdensome
identification requirements and unduly restrictive times and places for
the exercise of the franchise.
The “Pledge to America” and the “Contract from America” challenge us to
recall our beginnings as a nation and revisit the ideas and ideals that
form the basis of our government and society. This analysis is mandatory
because, as Adler said, the Declaration of Independence and the
Constitution are the “American testament” and in relation to one another,
“they are like the sacred scriptures of this nation.” There are even
older scriptures, however, in the New Testament and the Torah that define
the just and proper balance between the imperatives of liberty and
equality (2 Corinthians 8:13-15, New Living Translation of the Bible;
Exodus 16:18, Revised Standard Version of the Bible):

Of course, I don’t mean that you should give so much that you suffer
from having too little. I only mean that there should be some equality.
Right now you have plenty and can help them. Then at some other time they
can share with you when you need it. In this way, everyone’s needs will
be met. Do you remember what the Scriptures say about this? “The one who
had much did not have too much, and the one who had little did not have
too little.”

John D'Amico is a retired Judge of the Superior Court of New Jersey. He
has held elective office at the local, county and state levels, is a
former State Senator, and also served as the Chairman of the New Jersey
State Parole Board.
--
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Not dead, in jail or a slave? Thank a liberal!
AlleyCat
2013-05-11 22:39:20 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...

Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-11 22:44:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
MattB .
2013-05-11 22:47:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
We could do with less of this


opel
2013-05-11 22:55:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
Why not?

Can't you conceive of how to cut entitlements?
Robert A. Leffingwell
2013-05-12 18:21:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
Why not?
Can't you conceive of how to cut entitlements?
I'm for taking your mother off Medicare. The old bitch doesn't deserve it
anyway. Look at the shit she brought into the world.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 00:00:22 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 11 May 2013 15:44:46 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
No more money for studying squirrels nuts... and I ain't talking acorns,
doofus.
Hell Stomper
2013-05-12 00:11:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 00:40:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hell Stomper
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Then why are Republican whining about it?
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
Zepp
2013-05-12 01:09:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
In article
Post by Hell Stomper
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Then why are Republican whining about it?
They aren't whining about it. In fact, they are desperately hoping the
media won't start focusing on it.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 02:01:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
They aren't whining about it. In fact, they are desperately hoping
the media won't start focusing on it.
Since the media have pretty much ignored the WHOLE Benghazi "story" up
until this past week, you would have had to get the information on
budgetary cuts from Fox NEWS. What's up with that? You a closet
Conservative? Oh, that's right... know your enemies and all that shit,
right? No... the budgetary cuts are the LEAST of the administrations
worries. Men, troops, tanks, guns, etc., could have been moved to
Benghazi LONG before 9/11/12. The fact that it wasn't, and now there's a
cover-up? Makes ya go Hmmmm.
Zepp
2013-05-12 03:09:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
Post by Zepp
They aren't whining about it. In fact, they are desperately hoping the
media won't start focusing on it.
Since the media have pretty much ignored the WHOLE Benghazi "story" up
until this past week, you would have had to get the information on
budgetary cuts from Fox NEWS. What's up with that? You a closet
Conservative? Oh, that's right... know your enemies and all that shit,
right? No... the budgetary cuts are the LEAST of the administrations
worries. Men, troops, tanks, guns, etc., could have been moved to
Benghazi LONG before 9/11/12. The fact that it wasn't, and now there's a
cover-up? Makes ya go Hmmmm.
Actually, they were talking about the Congressional budget cuts on the
legitimate media in the days following the attack. I imagine Faux news
forgot to discuss that, somehow.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 04:21:39 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:09:26 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmn156$uea$14
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Actually, they were talking about the Congressional budget cuts on the
illegitimate media in the days following the attack.
So, Conservatives aren't allowed to attack anything or anybody, but the
"legitimate" media can start attacking so-called "Republican" budget
cuts? That doesn't matter... moot point. This whole Benghazi affair is
NOT about the attack, per se... it's about the cover-up. Idiot.
Post by Zepp
I imagine Faux news forgot to discuss that, somehow.
How would you know? If there was nothing there to discuss... The libtard
press is trying to protect their Messiah. Coming up with excuses FOR
Benghazi, are/were reprehensible. Same as what Hillary said... "At this
point... what does it matter?" Those men weren't killed because of
budget cuts, made because Democraps are spending us into oblivion...
no... they were killed by MUSLIMS. O'Reilly had it right when he was on
"The View" when those pissy bitches walked off. MUSLIMS killed us.

Legitimate news, huh?

NBC Lies:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/19/msnbc-edits-romney-rally-
speech-portrays-candidate-as-out-touch/
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2011/08/16/ed-schultz-edits-
rick-perry-falsely-accuse-him-making-racist-remark-a#ixzz1qv7FzaFJ
http://video.foxnews.com/v/1551844899001/nbc-edits-zimmermans-911-tape/
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/05/03/msnbc-forced-to-apologize-
after-egregiously-taking-quotes-out-of-context-for-gun-control-segment/

What an ugly bitch:

Rep. Carolyn B. Maloney. The New York Democrat opened her question time
with a full throttled defense of Clinton, despite the fact that the
former secretary of state's name HAD YET to arise in any meaningful way
at that early point in the hearing. None of the witnesses had yet made
comments that were particularly problematic for the possible 2016
presidential candidate. But Maloney's very deliberate remarks signaled
that Democrats are sensitive to how the House GOP investigation into
Benghazi might affect Clinton, regardless of its partisan overtones.

"I find it truly disturbing and very unfortunate that when Americans
come under attack the first thing some did in this country was attack
Americans, attack the military, attack the president, attack the State
Department, attack the former senator from the great state of New York
and former secretary of state Hillary Clinton," Maloney said, before
going on to question the witnesses on the fact that the secretary of
state's signature is included on all sorts of documents he or she never
actually sees.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 06:12:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:09:26 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmn156$uea$14
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Actually, they were talking about the Congressional budget cuts on the
illegitimate media in the days following the attack.
So, Conservatives aren't allowed to attack anything or anybody, but the
"legitimate" media can start attacking so-called "Republican" budget
cuts? That doesn't matter... moot point. This whole Benghazi affair is
NOT about the attack, per se... it's about the cover-up. Idiot.
Yes, yes, yes. It took years before we learned the ambassador was murderred.
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
opel
2013-05-12 17:13:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:09:26 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmn156$uea$14
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Actually, they were talking about the Congressional budget cuts on the
illegitimate media in the days following the attack.
So, Conservatives aren't allowed to attack anything or anybody, but the
"legitimate" media can start attacking so-called "Republican" budget
cuts? That doesn't matter... moot point. This whole Benghazi affair is
NOT about the attack, per se... it's about the cover-up. Idiot.
Yes, yes, yes. It took years before we learned the ambassador was murderred.
It took 8 months for the media to focus on it.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 00:30:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:09:26 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmn156$uea$14
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Actually, they were talking about the Congressional budget cuts on the
illegitimate media in the days following the attack.
So, Conservatives aren't allowed to attack anything or anybody, but the
"legitimate" media can start attacking so-called "Republican" budget
cuts? That doesn't matter... moot point. This whole Benghazi affair is
NOT about the attack, per se... it's about the cover-up. Idiot.
Yes, yes, yes. It took years before we learned the ambassador was murderred.
It took 8 months for the media to focus on it.
Actually I heard about it back when it happenned.
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-13 01:34:18 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 17:30:53 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Actually I heard about it back when it happenned.
Closet Fox watcher. Keep watching... maybe you'll learn more, about your
beloved Muslim dick supplier. How much did your knee-pads cost?
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 01:38:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 17:30:53 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Actually I heard about it back when it happenned.
Closet Fox watcher. Keep watching... maybe you'll learn more, about your
beloved Muslim dick supplier. How much did your knee-pads cost?
So has any woman looked at your equipment without peals of laughter?
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-13 03:39:45 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 18:38:25 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
So has any woman looked at your equipment without peals of laughter?
Yup, nerd. I laid more women in ONE summer, than you EVER will. My wife
laughed a lot, but that's when she couldn't help herself. How many women
have you pleasured until they came and laughed uncontrollably, because
she felt so good? I have a feeling it's nil.

Wouldn't that be "squeals" of laughter. Please, take some remedial
reading and writing classes.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 04:08:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 18:38:25 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
So has any woman looked at your equipment without peals of laughter?
Yup, nerd. I laid more women in ONE summer, than you EVER will. My wife
laughed a lot, but that's when she couldn't help herself. How many women
Yes, I can see how she would enjoy your boasts how many other women laughed at
you.
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 04:54:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
worries. Men, troops, tanks, guns, etc., could have been moved to
Benghazi LONG before 9/11/12. The fact that it wasn't, and now there's a
cover-up? Makes ya go Hmmmm.
What makes you think Libya would permit a heavily fortified consulate?
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
Zepp
2013-05-12 06:08:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
worries. Men, troops, tanks, guns, etc., could have been moved to
Benghazi LONG before 9/11/12. The fact that it wasn't, and now there's
a cover-up? Makes ya go Hmmmm.
What makes you think Libya would permit a heavily fortified consulate?
Or for that matter, Congress, which slashed spending for consulate
security worldwide.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 08:02:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Or for that matter, Congress, which slashed spending for consulate
security worldwide.
And yet, Benghazi is the only Consulate to have "fallen". Why is that?
What did the TERRORISTS know?

Give them what they need, in the first place, then give them what they
need if they ask for more. Simple.



What made the consulate office in Benghazi more vulnerable than the
embassy in Tripoli?

The embassy in Tripoli is a fairly new facility. It was constructed in
2009 in accordance with security standards established by the Diplomatic
Security Service at the State Department. The building in Benghazi was
basically a villa that was being rented to serve as a temporary
consulate. So it was built in accordance with your normal residential
security standards for Libya. It was not made to withstand rocket or
bomb attacks. So it was not a very secure facility at all.

How can any building be protected against rocket-propelled grenades?

Inman facilities are designed and engineered and constructed to
withstand attacks from weapons like rocket-propelled grenades. (The
Inman Commission was established in 1985 after the U.S. Embassy bombings
in Beirut, Lebanon, to develop new security standards.) There are
certain thicknesses of the walls and certain types of reinforced
concrete, certain angles that the walls have, and distance to the street
that make them much more difficult to attack. The embassy in Tripoli,
Libya, and the one in Sanaa, Yemen, which was just attacked today, are
Inman facilities, so it's going to be much more difficult to damage
them.

Who's responsible for security at an embassy -- the host country or the
embassy itself?

There's a dual responsibility. Under the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic
Relations, the host country is responsible for security of embassies.
However, experience has taught the Americans that they can't rely on the
host country to do that. They've experienced big losses in places like
Kuwait, and Beirut a couple of times, even in Islamabad, Pakistan, when
it was burnt to the ground. So they've learned they need to establish
their own security bureaucracy to take care of that, and the Diplomatic
Security Service (or law enforcement arm of the State Department) came
into being in the mid-1980s.

What can be done to step up security at U.S. embassies?

One of the things you can do is draw down on personnel, which is what
they did in Libya. They had an ordered departure, where they had
nonessential personnel, family members and dependents evacuated from the
country. The other thing is to draw down American personnel from
vulnerable facilities like Benghazi and leave the local personnel in
charge of the facility to conduct business because they are less of a
target. They can increase the local police and military presence outside
the perimeter. They can also bring in additional Marines like they have
done now in Tripoli.

Which embassies have a Marine presence?

It's usually at the larger facilities, like Sanaa, Yemen, and Cairo,
Egypt. At the smaller consulates and sometimes at smaller embassies, you
don't have Marines stationed there. It depends on the post, the number
of Americans there and the amount of classified information that needs
to be protected. And sometimes even the political sensibilities of the
country.

Which embassies are most at risk of attacks?

The State Department looks at that carefully. When you look at the
profile of what happened in Benghazi, it was a recently established
facility in a place where the bureaucracy hadn't caught up with it yet.
So Congress hadn't appropriated money and the Bureau of Overseas
Buildings Operations didn't have the opportunity to really plan and
build a new facility there that meets security specifications. Anytime
you have a new embassy in that kind of situation, you don't really have
any real security. Places that are new, like in South Sudan, which is a
new country, might have issues. A well-established facility in the
Middle East can be attacked -- as we've seen in Cairo and Sanaa -- but
when it's a well-built, well-fortified structure, it's much more
difficult to impact.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 09:10:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
Post by Zepp
Or for that matter, Congress, which slashed spending for consulate
security worldwide.
And yet, Benghazi is the only Consulate to have "fallen". Why is that?
Recently. During Bush consulates and embassies where attacked in Pakistan,
Yemen, and elsewhere, killing diplomats in some cases.
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
opel
2013-05-12 17:15:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
Post by Zepp
Or for that matter, Congress, which slashed spending for consulate
security worldwide.
And yet, Benghazi is the only Consulate to have "fallen". Why is that?
Recently.
Forgot about the riots in Egypt already?

Bawack couldn't remember that Egypt is a Major Non Nato Ally...

What a maroon.
AlleyCat
2013-05-13 01:32:37 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 02:10:59 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Recently. During Bush consulates and embassies where attacked in
Pakistan, Yemen, and elsewhere, killing diplomats in some cases.
What the fuck is a "Bush" consulate. I didn't know he built them on his
own. Obama doesn't "own" the Benghazi attack... he OWNS the cover-up,
nerd. Keep deflecting from that, dork... it's easy to dispel your stupid
blame game. Your obvious love for Obama's crotch, is noted. Thank you.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 01:36:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 02:10:59 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Recently. During Bush consulates and embassies where attacked in
Pakistan, Yemen, and elsewhere, killing diplomats in some cases.
What the fuck is a "Bush" consulate. I didn't know he built them on his
own. Obama doesn't "own" the Benghazi attack... he OWNS the cover-up,
nerd. Keep deflecting from that, dork... it's easy to dispel your stupid
blame game. Your obvious love for Obama's crotch, is noted. Thank you.
Thanks for conceding.

And you're still a hypocrite.
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-13 03:35:24 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 18:36:02 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Thanks for conceding.
Reading Comprehension | Adolescent Liberal Literacy 101

About reading comprehension. On occasion, even the most highly literate
Liberals find themselves reading something without understanding it. For
instance, sleepy ...

Liberals often struggle with any or all four of these comprehension
problems: difficulty monitoring their own understanding while reading,
difficulty making sense of unfamiliar content, difficulty making sense
of specialized terms and concepts, and difficulty making sense of
familiar words used in specialized or unusual ways.

Learn it, love it, live it...

http://www.adlit.org/adlit_
101/improving_literacy_instruction_in_your_school/reading_comprehension/
Zepp
2013-05-12 15:04:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
Post by Zepp
Or for that matter, Congress, which slashed spending for consulate
security worldwide.
And yet, Benghazi is the only Consulate to have "fallen". Why is that?
What did the TERRORISTS know?
Given how right wingers behave, I wouldn't be surprised if the GOP didn't
slip information to al Qaida on what and when to attack in hopes of
embarrassing Obama.
Post by AlleyCat
Give them what they need, in the first place, then give them what they
need if they ask for more. Simple.
What made the consulate office in Benghazi more vulnerable than the
embassy in Tripoli?
The embassy in Tripoli is a fairly new facility. It was constructed in
2009 in accordance with security standards established by the Diplomatic
Security Service at the State Department. The building in Benghazi was
basically a villa that was being rented to serve as a temporary
consulate. So it was built in accordance with your normal residential
security standards for Libya. It was not made to withstand rocket or
bomb attacks. So it was not a very secure facility at all.
How can any building be protected against rocket-propelled grenades?
Inman facilities are designed and engineered and constructed to
withstand attacks from weapons like rocket-propelled grenades. (The
Inman Commission was established in 1985 after the U.S. Embassy bombings
in Beirut, Lebanon, to develop new security standards.) There are
certain thicknesses of the walls and certain types of reinforced
concrete, certain angles that the walls have, and distance to the street
that make them much more difficult to attack. The embassy in Tripoli,
Libya, and the one in Sanaa, Yemen, which was just attacked today, are
Inman facilities, so it's going to be much more difficult to damage
them.
Who's responsible for security at an embassy -- the host country or the
embassy itself?
There's a dual responsibility. Under the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic
Relations, the host country is responsible for security of embassies.
However, experience has taught the Americans that they can't rely on the
host country to do that. They've experienced big losses in places like
Kuwait, and Beirut a couple of times, even in Islamabad, Pakistan, when
it was burnt to the ground. So they've learned they need to establish
their own security bureaucracy to take care of that, and the Diplomatic
Security Service (or law enforcement arm of the State Department) came
into being in the mid-1980s.
What can be done to step up security at U.S. embassies?
One of the things you can do is draw down on personnel, which is what
they did in Libya. They had an ordered departure, where they had
nonessential personnel, family members and dependents evacuated from the
country. The other thing is to draw down American personnel from
vulnerable facilities like Benghazi and leave the local personnel in
charge of the facility to conduct business because they are less of a
target. They can increase the local police and military presence outside
the perimeter. They can also bring in additional Marines like they have
done now in Tripoli.
Which embassies have a Marine presence?
It's usually at the larger facilities, like Sanaa, Yemen, and Cairo,
Egypt. At the smaller consulates and sometimes at smaller embassies, you
don't have Marines stationed there. It depends on the post, the number
of Americans there and the amount of classified information that needs
to be protected. And sometimes even the political sensibilities of the
country.
Which embassies are most at risk of attacks?
The State Department looks at that carefully. When you look at the
profile of what happened in Benghazi, it was a recently established
facility in a place where the bureaucracy hadn't caught up with it yet.
So Congress hadn't appropriated money and the Bureau of Overseas
Buildings Operations didn't have the opportunity to really plan and
build a new facility there that meets security specifications. Anytime
you have a new embassy in that kind of situation, you don't really have
any real security. Places that are new, like in South Sudan, which is a
new country, might have issues. A well-established facility in the
Middle East can be attacked -- as we've seen in Cairo and Sanaa -- but
when it's a well-built, well-fortified structure, it's much more
difficult to impact.
opel
2013-05-12 17:32:05 UTC
Permalink
On 5/12/2013 9:04 AM, Zepp wrote:

= Loading Image...

...fat, fluffy-necked, canuckleheaded ex-pat trash.
Steve
2013-05-12 19:46:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Post by AlleyCat
Post by Zepp
Or for that matter, Congress, which slashed spending for consulate
security worldwide.
And yet, Benghazi is the only Consulate to have "fallen". Why is that?
What did the TERRORISTS know?
Given how right wingers behave, I wouldn't be surprised if the GOP didn't
slip information to al Qaida on what and when to attack in hopes of
embarrassing Obama.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/05/exclusive-benghazi-talking-points-underwent-12-revisions-scrubbed-of-terror-references/
Exclusive: Benghazi Talking Points Underwent 12 Revisions, Scrubbed of
Terror Reference
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 22:43:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Given how right wingers behave, I wouldn't be surprised if the GOP
didn't slip information to al Qaida on what and when to attack in
hopes of embarrassing Obama.
Damn... I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, that you weren't a
crazy left-wing ideologue loon... doubt removed... PLONK! I don't
normally plonk people, but you're just too far out in left-field to have
a serious conversation with. Zepp and # plonked. Thanks for playing
along, loony bin recipient.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 08:00:18 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:54:26 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
What makes you think Libya would permit a heavily fortified consulate?
Are you really that stupid?

First off, I didn't say anything about "a heavily fortified consulate".
Secondly: you don't HAVE to "heavily fortify' anything over and beyond
what is needed... what is in place in other parts of the world... just
get them what they needed. Benghazi was a "temporary" compound.

----------

For a third day, demonstrators tried to break into U.S. embassies --
this time in Yemen and Egypt -- but the results weren't nearly as
catastrophic as what unfolded at the consulate in Benghazi, Libya.

That's because the buildings are more fortified than the temporary
structure in Benghazi, and have security measures that were put in place
after the 1983 bombing of the U.S. Embassy in Beirut, Lebanon, said
Scott Stewart, vice president of analysis at Stratfor and a special
agent with the State Department from 1988 to 1998.

On Tuesday night, protesters torched the consulate in Benghazi, killing
U.S. Ambassador Chris Stevens, information manager Sean Smith, former
Navy SEAL Glen Doherty, and a fourth embassy worker.

What made the consulate office in Benghazi more vulnerable than the
embassy in Tripoli?

The embassy in Tripoli is a fairly new facility. It was constructed in
2009 in accordance with security standards established by the Diplomatic
Security Service at the State Department. The building in Benghazi was
basically a villa that was being rented to serve as a temporary
consulate. So it was built in accordance with your normal residential
security standards for Libya. It was not made to withstand rocket or
bomb attacks. So it was not a very secure facility at all.

How can any building be protected against rocket-propelled grenades?

Inman facilities are designed and engineered and constructed to
withstand attacks from weapons like rocket-propelled grenades. (The
Inman Commission was established in 1985 after the U.S. Embassy bombings
in Beirut, Lebanon, to develop new security standards.) There are
certain thicknesses of the walls and certain types of reinforced
concrete, certain angles that the walls have, and distance to the street
that make them much more difficult to attack. The embassy in Tripoli,
Libya, and the one in Sanaa, Yemen, which was just attacked today, are
Inman facilities, so it's going to be much more difficult to damage
them.

Who's responsible for security at an embassy -- the host country or the
embassy itself?

There's a dual responsibility. Under the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic
Relations, the host country is responsible for security of embassies.
However, experience has taught the Americans that they can't rely on the
host country to do that. They've experienced big losses in places like
Kuwait, and Beirut a couple of times, even in Islamabad, Pakistan, when
it was burnt to the ground. So they've learned they need to establish
their own security bureaucracy to take care of that, and the Diplomatic
Security Service (or law enforcement arm of the State Department) came
into being in the mid-1980s.

What can be done to step up security at U.S. embassies?

One of the things you can do is draw down on personnel, which is what
they did in Libya. They had an ordered departure, where they had
nonessential personnel, family members and dependents evacuated from the
country. The other thing is to draw down American personnel from
vulnerable facilities like Benghazi and leave the local personnel in
charge of the facility to conduct business because they are less of a
target. They can increase the local police and military presence outside
the perimeter. They can also bring in additional Marines like they have
done now in Tripoli.

Which embassies have a Marine presence?

It's usually at the larger facilities, like Sanaa, Yemen, and Cairo,
Egypt. At the smaller consulates and sometimes at smaller embassies, you
don't have Marines stationed there. It depends on the post, the number
of Americans there and the amount of classified information that needs
to be protected. And sometimes even the political sensibilities of the
country.

Which embassies are most at risk of attacks?

The State Department looks at that carefully. When you look at the
profile of what happened in Benghazi, it was a recently established
facility in a place where the bureaucracy hadn't caught up with it yet.
So Congress hadn't appropriated money and the Bureau of Overseas
Buildings Operations didn't have the opportunity to really plan and
build a new facility there that meets security specifications. Anytime
you have a new embassy in that kind of situation, you don't really have
any real security. Places that are new, like in South Sudan, which is a
new country, might have issues. A well-established facility in the
Middle East can be attacked -- as we've seen in Cairo and Sanaa -- but
when it's a well-built, well-fortified structure, it's much more
difficult to impact.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 09:15:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:54:26 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
What makes you think Libya would permit a heavily fortified consulate?
Are you really that stupid?
worries. Men, troops, tanks, guns, etc., could have been moved to
Benghazi LONG before 9/11/12. The fact that it wasn't, and now there's a
First off, I didn't say anything about "a heavily fortified consulate".
How many consulates do you know wth their own tank platoon?
Post by AlleyCat
Secondly: you don't HAVE to "heavily fortify' anything over and beyond
what is needed... what is in place in other parts of the world... just
get them what they needed. Benghazi was a "temporary" compound.
The primary purpose of a consulate is to serve Americans in another country.
With new business opportunities in oil and elsewhere in Libya, what do you want?
To discourage American businessfolk? That consulate had also been used to house
a large CIA contingent: something the CIA and State Department did not want to
advertise.
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
Zepp
2013-05-12 14:52:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:54:26 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
What makes you think Libya would permit a heavily fortified
consulate?
Are you really that stupid?
worries. Men, troops, tanks, guns, etc., could have been moved to
Benghazi LONG before 9/11/12. The fact that it wasn't, and now there's a
First off, I didn't say anything about "a heavily fortified consulate".
How many consulates do you know wth their own tank platoon?
Post by AlleyCat
Secondly: you don't HAVE to "heavily fortify' anything over and beyond
what is needed... what is in place in other parts of the world... just
get them what they needed. Benghazi was a "temporary" compound.
The primary purpose of a consulate is to serve Americans in another
country. With new business opportunities in oil and elsewhere in Libya,
what do you want?
To discourage American businessfolk? That consulate had also been used
to house a large CIA contingent: something the CIA and State Department
did not want to advertise.
And of course Meow Mix doesn't understand you have to PAY for adequate
protection of counselates--and the GOP Congress refused to do so.
opel
2013-05-12 17:15:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
irst off, I didn't say anything about "a heavily fortified consulate".
How many consulates do you know wth their own tank platoon?
Maybe we need more.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 00:24:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
irst off, I didn't say anything about "a heavily fortified consulate".
How many consulates do you know wth their own tank platoon?
Maybe we need more.
Good luck getting host countries to agree to that.
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-13 01:24:26 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 17:24:54 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Good luck getting host countries to agree to that.
We are The United Fucking States of America... we get them to agree, or
they don't get their "Muslim Brotherhood" money from Obama. I guess
you're not American. I don't want to waste my time with a jealous nerd.
Buh bye.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 01:31:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 17:24:54 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Good luck getting host countries to agree to that.
We are The United Fucking States of America... we get them to agree, or
they don't get their "Muslim Brotherhood" money from Obama. I guess
you're not American. I don't want to waste my time with a jealous nerd.
Buh bye.
You've decided you don't want any US businesses to profit from Libyan oil. What
are opportunities for profit do you want to piss away?
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-13 03:31:03 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 18:31:55 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
You've decided you don't want any US businesses to profit from Libyan
oil. What are opportunities for profit do you want to piss away?
BWAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Libya needs our money more than we need it's oil, doofus. Thanks for the
laugh.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 04:30:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 18:31:55 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
You've decided you don't want any US businesses to profit from Libyan
oil. What are opportunities for profit do you want to piss away?
BWAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Libya needs our money more than we need it's oil, doofus. Thanks for the
laugh.
And Britain and Holland are ready to invest,
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-14 02:22:46 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 21:30:45 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
And Britain and Holland are ready to invest,
Big whoop... America has more oil than all of the Middle East, combined,
at it's disposal. We just have to get past the tree-hugging limp-
wristers, such as yourself, to reap what we need to be foreign oil
dependent free.
AlleyCat
2013-05-13 01:22:35 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 02:15:05 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
How many consulates do you know wth their own tank platoon?
About the same number of nerdy liberals, who throw "reducio ad
absurdum" statements out when faced with facts, and are brilliant.

Ummm... none.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 01:56:17 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 11 May 2013 17:40:50 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Then why are Republican whining about it?
That's not the only issue, and I don't think Republicans are whining
about budget cuts, per se.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 04:55:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 17:40:50 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Then why are Republican whining about it?
That's not the only issue, and I don't think Republicans are whining
about budget cuts, per se.
Of course not. You're just whining about Clinton not spending the money
Republicans didn't give her?
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 07:50:57 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:55:43 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Of course not. You're just whining about Clinton not spending the money
Republicans didn't give her?
Aaaangh, wrong. Tell him what he lost, Johnny!

This was no boating accident! This is about the cover-up, that Susan
Rice, President Obama and Hillary Clinton are perpetrating on the
American people. If you're not American, piss off and fuhgetaboutit,
dick.

What Part of "Taxed Enough Already" Don't YOU Understand?
Zepp
2013-05-12 15:05:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:55:43 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Of course not. You're just whining about Clinton not spending the
money
Post by Siri Cruise
Republicans didn't give her?
Aaaangh, wrong. Tell him what he lost, Johnny!
This was no boating accident! This is about the cover-up, that Susan
Rice, President Obama and Hillary Clinton are perpetrating on the
American people. If you're not American, piss off and fuhgetaboutit,
dick.
What Part of "Taxed Enough Already" Don't YOU Understand?
Except there was no coverup. There was confusion, certainly.
opel
2013-05-12 17:32:19 UTC
Permalink
On 5/12/2013 9:05 AM, Zepp wrote:


= http://thehumanist.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/Jamieson-1.jpg

...fat, fluffy-necked, canuckleheaded ex-pat trash.
Steve
2013-05-12 19:46:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:55:43 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Of course not. You're just whining about Clinton not spending the
money
Post by Siri Cruise
Republicans didn't give her?
Aaaangh, wrong. Tell him what he lost, Johnny!
This was no boating accident! This is about the cover-up, that Susan
Rice, President Obama and Hillary Clinton are perpetrating on the
American people. If you're not American, piss off and fuhgetaboutit,
dick.
What Part of "Taxed Enough Already" Don't YOU Understand?
Except there was no coverup. There was confusion, certainly.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/05/exclusive-benghazi-talking-points-underwent-12-revisions-scrubbed-of-terror-references/
Exclusive: Benghazi Talking Points Underwent 12 Revisions, Scrubbed of
Terror Reference
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 22:38:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Except there was no coverup. There was confusion, certainly.
THAT'S A COVER-UP TO THE COVER-UP, you fucking lackey.

http://video.foxnews.com/v/2372122549001/new-york-times-labels-benghazi-
as-gop-obsession/
Zepp
2013-05-12 00:39:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hell Stomper
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Actually, Steve, it did play a role. Funding for consultates was cut by
the GOP, by a third. One result was a lot of Marines were shipped out
and replaced as guards by local talent.

Looks like the GOP murdered those four people.
Steve
2013-05-12 00:49:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Post by Hell Stomper
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Actually, Steve,
Poor Zepp, How many times has he been wrong about who I am..


"Several of us know who he is these days, you see. "
David B. Jamieson (Zepp)
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.society.liberalism/msg/0977448acdf3c416?hl=en

Canyon Note: Sooooo, who am I, these days, Dummy?
opel
2013-05-12 01:17:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Post by Hell Stomper
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Actually, Steve, it did play a role. Funding for consultates was cut by
the GOP,
Billary refused to re-capitalize them.

That's the party in POWER's fault.

Cope, asshole.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 01:24:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Zepp
Post by Hell Stomper
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Actually, Steve, it did play a role. Funding for consultates was cut by
the GOP,
Billary refused to re-capitalize them.
Recapitalise? Recapitalise? The State Department is expected to sell shares in
the embassies to investors?

Did it escape your education that every dollar spent by the executive must be
approved by Congress?
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 01:55:16 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 11 May 2013 18:24:00 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Did it escape your education that every dollar spent by the executive
must be approved by Congress?
True, but the budgets are set... the money is spent. There's absolutely
no reason why forces or personnel couldn't have been "shifted" to
Benghazi away from a place that's not so "hot". When someone asks for
help, they should have at least looked into it. It was denied without
Hillary even knowing about it... or was she. Pretty fucking convenient,
her retirement from Secretary of State. Pretty fucking convenient, her
head bump and subsequent hemorrhage (concussion). How fucking
convenient, indeed... "what difference does it make now?" Plenty, you
ugly fucking cunt. Ask that of the families of the victim's. I guess
death doesn't really matter to Hillary... she's used to it.

http://earlcallaway.com/corpsecount.html

Clinton Corpse Collection:

I've investigated a lot of crimes over the last 32 years, including
murders. Any criminal investigator with the slightest bit of experience
and training could easily see (and most have seen) the many flaws, holes
and gaps in the so-called Vince Foster "murder" investigation by, of all
the federal law enforcement agencies, the Park Police. But, when one
does a little more checking into the past of Bill and Hillary Clinton,
they will find a long path of former friends, associates and business
partners of the Clinton's who have died young and under mysterious
circumstances. The following is a partial list of those whose blood
cries out for justice.

Kevin Ives and Don Henry: Died August 1987. Reportedly, they had
stumbled upon the Arkansas Mena Drug Operation (many stories and
articles have been written about Clinton's affiliation with the Mena
Mafia) It was first reported that these two young boys died as a result
of falling asleep on a railroad track. It was later revealed that Ives
had received a crushed skull prior to being placed on the tracks and
Henry had been stabbed to death. The following 7 deaths were all of
people who reportedly had knowledge and information concerning the
mysterious, unsolved murders of Kevin Ives and Don Henry:


Keith Coney: died July 1988 from injuries sustained from a motorcycle
accident. Some reports indicated that he was being chased by an
unidentified vehicle.

Keith McKaskle: died Nov. 1988 from multiple stab wounds

Greg Collins: died Jan. 1989 from a gunshot wound to the head. No suspect
was ever found.

Jeff Rhodes: died April 1989 from a gunshot wound to the head. His body
was burned and thrown in a dumpster.

James Milam: died 1989. His death was ruled as being from natural
causes, until his head was later recovered from a trash bin!

Richard Winters: died July 1990 from injuries sustained during a robbery
attempt. He was a suspect in the death of Kevin Ives and Don Henry. Some
reports claim the robbery was only a setup.

Jordan Kettleson: died June 1990. He died from gunshot wounds and was
found sitting in his truck.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 04:57:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
True, but the budgets are set... the money is spent. There's absolutely
no reason why forces or personnel couldn't have been "shifted" to
Benghazi away from a place that's not so "hot". When someone asks for
Whence? Name which consulate you want to be stripped down.
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 07:45:36 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:57:38 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
True, but the budgets are set... the money is spent. There's
absolutely
no reason why forces or personnel couldn't have been "shifted" to
Benghazi away from a place that's not so "hot". When someone asks for
Whence? Name which consulate you want to be stripped down.
Whence? Please cite where I said I wanted to strip down ANYTHING, let
alone a Consulate. Is it some kind of disease that you libturds have,
that makes you see or read shit into what people write, that just isn't
there?

When Ambassador Stevens asked for more security, Shirley, there HAD to
be a "post" somewhere, that could have had resources shifted.

Pick ONE:

Reno, Chicago, Fargo, Minnesota,
Buffalo, Toronto, Winslow, Sarasota,
Wichita, Tulsa, Ottawa, Oklahoma,
Tampa, Panama, Mattawa, La Paloma,
Bangor, Baltimore, Salvador, Amarillo,
Tocapillo, Baranquilla, and Perdilla
Boston, Charleston, Dayton, Louisiana,
Washington, Houston, Kingston, Texarkana,
Monterey, Faraday, Santa Fe, Tallapoosa,
Glen Rock, Black Rock, Little Rock, Oskaloosa,
Tennessee to Tennesse Chicopee, Spirit Lake,
Grand Lake, Devils Lake, Crater Lake
Louisville, Nashville, Knoxville, Ombabika,
Schefferville, Jacksonville, Waterville, Costa Rica,
Pittsfield, Springfield, Bakersfield, Shreveport,
Hackensack, Cadillac, Fond du Lac, Davenport,
Idaho, Jellico, Argentina, Diamantina,
Pasadena, Catalina

LOL Pussy. Come on... let's see whatchu got. You're so clever. Come
on... gimme one of them thar pithy clever retorts.

Here's a good one of yours. Since I quoted The man in black...

Mommy says the Men in Black are from Sea Org. Or Johnny Cash. - Siri
opel
2013-05-12 03:51:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by opel
Post by Zepp
Post by Hell Stomper
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Actually, Steve, it did play a role. Funding for consultates was cut by
the GOP,
Billary refused to re-capitalize them.
Recapitalise? Recapitalise?
Are you canuck or limey?

In either event, berloody bugger off, you moron.

She refused their security requests, capisce?
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 06:10:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by opel
Post by Zepp
Post by Hell Stomper
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Actually, Steve, it did play a role. Funding for consultates was cut by
the GOP,
Billary refused to re-capitalize them.
Recapitalise? Recapitalise?
Are you canuck or limey?
In either event, berloody bugger off, you moron.
She refused their security requests, capisce?
Capisce? What are you? Neopolatin?
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
opel
2013-05-12 17:12:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by opel
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by opel
Post by Zepp
Post by Hell Stomper
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
So no more money for embassy and consulate security?
It has already been shown that funding was not the issue in Benghazi.
The issue was Obama's reelection.
Actually, Steve, it did play a role. Funding for consultates was cut by
the GOP,
Billary refused to re-capitalize them.
Recapitalise? Recapitalise?
Are you canuck or limey?
In either event, berloody bugger off, you moron.
She refused their security requests, capisce?
Capisce?
Dry up, cat lady.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 01:46:49 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 00:39:07 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmoba$ftl$37
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Looks like the GOP murdered those four people.
Nope... Ambassador Stevens asked for more security. He was denied by the
Democrap "Peace, Love Muslims" crowd.

There are myriad "issues" behind Benghazi, from budget cuts, denial of
more security, to the Cover-up and all that is in between.

Did the cover-up spawn out of Obama's reach for the Golden Ring a second
time? Perhaps... but what exactly are they trying to cover up, and why?
Was it the budget constraints, the lack of more security, Hillary's
denials of security denial, Muslim sympathy... make your own reason...
there are plenty to go around.
Just don't deny there's no cover-up. If this would have happened the
exact same way while Bush, Nixon or Reagan were in office, there'd be so
many committees formed, Washington would be in gridlock for years, and
journalists would all become gazillionaires.
FirstPost
2013-05-12 02:21:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 00:39:07 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmoba$ftl$37
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Looks like the GOP murdered those four people.
Nope... Ambassador Stevens asked for more security. He was denied by the
Democrap "Peace, Love Muslims" crowd.
There are myriad "issues" behind Benghazi, from budget cuts, denial of
more security, to the Cover-up and all that is in between.
Did the cover-up spawn out of Obama's reach for the Golden Ring a second
time? Perhaps... but what exactly are they trying to cover up, and why?
Was it the budget constraints, the lack of more security, Hillary's
denials of security denial, Muslim sympathy... make your own reason...
there are plenty to go around.
Just don't deny there's no cover-up. If this would have happened the
exact same way while Bush, Nixon or Reagan were in office, there'd be so
many committees formed, Washington would be in gridlock for years, and
journalists would all become gazillionaires.
Budget cuts. The government spent $800,000 in “stimulus funds” to
study the impact of a “genital-washing program” on men in South Africa
but cuts funding for actual important programs and services like SSI
or expanded security for US embassies in "hot zones".

Other crap the Fed blows tons of cash on that should be cut before
talking about cutting things legitimately needed:
http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/30-stupid-things-the-governemnt-is-spending-money-on
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 05:05:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 00:39:07 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmoba$ftl$37
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Looks like the GOP murdered those four people.
Nope... Ambassador Stevens asked for more security. He was denied by the
Democrap "Peace, Love Muslims" crowd.
Do you want the US to invade countries all over the world to have military bases
in reach of every consulate? Or an aircraft carrier offshore of each? Are you
willing to pay taxes on that? What about the 40 or so killed while Bush was
around? Where was your outrage then?
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 07:37:25 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 11 May 2013 22:05:23 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
Do you want the US to invade countries all over the world to have
military bases in reach of every consulate?
Nope. Don't need to. Did I say that?
Post by Siri Cruise
Or an aircraft carrier offshore of each?
Nope. Don't need to. Did I say that?
Post by Siri Cruise
Are you willing to pay taxes on that?
Nope. Don't need to. Chicken or the egg, nerd... let's pay for things we
NEED, not what lazy, shiftless bums want.
Post by Siri Cruise
What about the 40 or so killed while Bush was
around? Where was your outrage then?
Ahh, more deflection.
I wasn't on Usenet in this group then. I AM outraged by ANY death at the
hands of Muslims(anyone for that matter). My outrage is against the
Muslim killings AND Obama's administration and minions covering their
asses for myriad reasons.

Nice try.
opel
2013-05-12 17:09:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 00:39:07 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmoba$ftl$37
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Looks like the GOP murdered those four people.
Nope... Ambassador Stevens asked for more security. He was denied by the
Democrap "Peace, Love Muslims" crowd.
Do you want the US to invade countries all over the world to have military bases
in reach of every consulate?
What kind of half-witted answer is that to am obvious security breach at
an extant facility?

You're a fucking MORON!
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 00:32:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 00:39:07 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmoba$ftl$37
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Looks like the GOP murdered those four people.
Nope... Ambassador Stevens asked for more security. He was denied by the
Democrap "Peace, Love Muslims" crowd.
Do you want the US to invade countries all over the world to have military bases
in reach of every consulate?
What kind of half-witted answer is that to am obvious security breach at
an extant facility?
So you want the military force and all of its logistics to appear out of thin
air.
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-13 03:01:18 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 17:32:17 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
So you want the military force and all of its logistics to appear out
of thin air.
Nah... they can appear out of the Northern sky, which would be a little
thinner than most.

The night it happened... was help 20 hours away, like they were told?
Nope.

Sigonella, Italy

Loading Image...

Help For Benghazi Was
NOT "20 Hours Away"

Gregory HIcks, former Deputy Chief of Mission in Libya at the time, was
told by the military "There were no planes available to refuel
aircraft."
Officials at CSPAN Benghazi hearings stated they were told by the US
military it would have taken 20 hours for help to arrive, and that was
why no help was sent.

America has bases in Italy. Over 100 of them.

Here are a few of the US military bases in Italy:

Aviano Air Base, Pordenone

Caserma Ederle, Vicenza

San Vito Dei Normanni Air Station, near Brindisi

Naval Air Station Sigonella, near Catania, Sicily

Camp Darby, near Pisa and Livorno

Italy is 777.9 miles from Benghazi. This shows help for the attacked
Benghazi consulate is NOT 20 hours away. By fighter plane, it would be
about one hour away.
By helicopter, about 3 to 4 hours away. Italy is just one example of
how close help was for the stormed consulate.

Not 20 hours. Lives could have been saved.

Here's a sample of critical facts from several hours of testimony aired
on CSPAN:

* Added to this Mr. Nordstrom and Mr. Thompson were not interviewed by
officials regarding the Benghazi event.

* Mark Thompson, counter-terrorism chief, was told to stay out of
meetings.

* Mr. Hicks stated, "They told me not to be interviewed by Congressman
Chavez."

Ted Twietmeyer
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 04:30:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 17:32:17 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
Post by Siri Cruise
So you want the military force and all of its logistics to appear out
of thin air.
Nah... they can appear out of the Northern sky, which would be a little
thinner than most.
The night it happened... was help 20 hours away, like they were told?
Nope.
Sigonella, Italy
http://oi39.tinypic.com/r7jhc0.jpg
Help For Benghazi Was
NOT "20 Hours Away"
Gregory HIcks, former Deputy Chief of Mission in Libya at the time, was
told by the military "There were no planes available to refuel
aircraft."
Officials at CSPAN Benghazi hearings stated they were told by the US
military it would have taken 20 hours for help to arrive, and that was
why no help was sent.
America has bases in Italy. Over 100 of them.
Aviano Air Base, Pordenone
Caserma Ederle, Vicenza
San Vito Dei Normanni Air Station, near Brindisi
Naval Air Station Sigonella, near Catania, Sicily
Camp Darby, near Pisa and Livorno
Italy is 777.9 miles from Benghazi. This shows help for the attacked
Benghazi consulate is NOT 20 hours away. By fighter plane, it would be
about one hour away.
Range of helicopters is 250 to 450 miles. Combat range of fighters is about 500
miles. Without refueling all of these aircraft would land in the Mediterrean
before reaching Libya. That's why air refueling would have to been arranged.

Aircraft also have to be armed, fueled, and prepped, all of which take more
time. The military is not designed to throw together a combat mission in
unfamilar territory on an hour's notice. Raids like this typically take days or
weeks, and even then the risk is substantial: unless they first attacked
friendly Libyan air defences any aircraft could be shot down.
Post by AlleyCat
By helicopter, about 3 to 4 hours away. Italy is just one example of
how close help was for the stormed consulate.
Italy is the closest and already too far. After that comes Spain, Croatia,
Greece, and Turkey, unless an aircraft carrier is off Libya. Even from a carrier
it would be some hours.

The fact that you play World of Warcraft all day instead of looking for a job
does not make you a military strategist, Leroy
Post by AlleyCat
Not 20 hours. Lives could have been saved.
Or more lives lost on a fool's errand.
Post by AlleyCat
Here's a sample of critical facts from several hours of testimony aired
Which one contradicts the military's appraisal of the situation as they
understood it?
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-14 02:20:15 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 21:30:00 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
***@news.eternal-september.org>, ***@yahoo.com
says...

http://oi39.tinypic.com/r7jhc0.jpg
Post by Siri Cruise
Range of helicopters is 250 to 450 miles. Combat range of fighters is
about 500 miles.
You are obviously NOT in the service.

What's the F-15's range?
Answer:
1,061 Nautical Miles, (1,222 Miles). This is the F-15's combat radius.

What is the range of the F16?
Answer:
2002 miles un-refueled. Range becomes unlimited with in-air refueling,
as long as the pilot is alert.

What is the range of the A-10?
Answer:
Ferry range: 2,240 nmi (2,580 mi, 4,150 km) with 50 knot (55 mph, 90
km/h) headwinds, 20 minutes reserve

The gun is ALWAYS on board. Wouldn't take but a few blasts from that
gun. Ever heard one? I grew up and lived around AF bases, my whole life.
They scare the shit out of you.
Post by Siri Cruise
Without refueling all of these aircraft would land in the Mediterrean
before reaching Libya. That's why air refueling would have to been arranged.
Yeah... duh.
Post by Siri Cruise
Aircraft also have to be armed, fueled, and prepped, all of which take more
time.
Doesn't take as long as you think. Are/were you in the service? No?
Going on what you read? Puhleaze.
Post by Siri Cruise
The military is not designed to throw together a combat mission in
unfamilar territory on an hour's notice.
You are so incredibly smart, but stupid.
Post by Siri Cruise
Raids like this typically take days or
weeks
You are a fucking moron. Must be a terrible burden to always THINK
you're the smartest nerd in the room.
Post by Siri Cruise
and even then the risk is substantial: unless they first attacked
friendly Libyan air defences any aircraft could be shot down.
Uh, you ask permission to fly over. If denied, there WILL be
consequences.
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
By helicopter, about 3 to 4 hours away. Italy is just one example of
how close help was for the stormed consulate.
Italy is the closest and already too far. After that comes Spain, Croatia,
Greece, and Turkey, unless an aircraft carrier is off Libya. Even from a carrier
it would be some hours.
Thanks for the Geography lesson. Don't bother... A+ student in that
dept.
Post by Siri Cruise
The fact that you play World of Warcraft all day instead of looking for a job
does not make you a military strategist, Leroy
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA That you even know what WOW is, shows your
nerdiness. I don't have to work, dork, I own. I "work" when I want. I'm
not claiming to be anything, let alone a military strategist... I'm just
arguing the idiotic statements OUR White House make.
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
Not 20 hours. Lives could have been saved.
Or more lives lost on a fool's errand.
Since when does America run from a fight? Ever since Obama took over and
neutered our Generals and military. ONE single blast of gunfire from an
A-10 or an Apache, would have scrambled those Muslims, like the
cockroaches that they are.
Teabaggers Lie
2013-05-14 03:54:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 21:30:00 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
says...
http://oi39.tinypic.com/r7jhc0.jpg
Post by Siri Cruise
Range of helicopters is 250 to 450 miles. Combat range of fighters is
about 500 miles.
You are obviously NOT in the service.
What's the F-15's range?
1,061 Nautical Miles, (1,222 Miles). This is the F-15's combat radius.
What is the range of the F16?
2002 miles un-refueled. Range becomes unlimited with in-air refueling,
as long as the pilot is alert.
What is the range of the A-10?
Ferry range: 2,240 nmi (2,580 mi, 4,150 km) with 50 knot (55 mph, 90
km/h) headwinds, 20 minutes reserve
The gun is ALWAYS on board. Wouldn't take but a few blasts from that
gun. Ever heard one? I grew up and lived around AF bases, my whole life.
They scare the shit out of you.
Post by Siri Cruise
Without refueling all of these aircraft would land in the Mediterrean
before reaching Libya. That's why air refueling would have to been arranged.
Yeah... duh.
Post by Siri Cruise
Aircraft also have to be armed, fueled, and prepped, all of which take more
time.
Doesn't take as long as you think. Are/were you in the service? No?
Going on what you read? Puhleaze.
Post by Siri Cruise
The military is not designed to throw together a combat mission in
unfamilar territory on an hour's notice.
You are so incredibly smart, but stupid.
Post by Siri Cruise
Raids like this typically take days or
weeks
You are a fucking moron. Must be a terrible burden to always THINK
you're the smartest nerd in the room.
Post by Siri Cruise
and even then the risk is substantial: unless they first attacked
friendly Libyan air defences any aircraft could be shot down.
Uh, you ask permission to fly over. If denied, there WILL be
consequences.
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
By helicopter, about 3 to 4 hours away. Italy is just one example of
how close help was for the stormed consulate.
Italy is the closest and already too far. After that comes Spain, Croatia,
Greece, and Turkey, unless an aircraft carrier is off Libya. Even from a carrier
it would be some hours.
Thanks for the Geography lesson. Don't bother... A+ student in that
dept.
Post by Siri Cruise
The fact that you play World of Warcraft all day instead of looking for a job
does not make you a military strategist, Leroy
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA That you even know what WOW is, shows your
nerdiness. I don't have to work, dork, I own. I "work" when I want. I'm
not claiming to be anything, let alone a military strategist... I'm just
arguing the idiotic statements OUR White House make.
Post by Siri Cruise
Post by AlleyCat
Not 20 hours. Lives could have been saved.
Or more lives lost on a fool's errand.
Since when does America run from a fight? Ever since Obama took over and
neutered our Generals and military. ONE single blast of gunfire from an
A-10 or an Apache, would have scrambled those Muslims, like the
cockroaches that they are.
But, Greg Hicks was the one whose job it was to notify Washington that there
was a problem in the first place, and by his own admission it wasn't until
after his favorite TV show was over that he realized that he'd missed two
phone calls to tell him that the consulate was under siege. I won't blame
Hicks alone, because it was another hour before State and DoD notified
Obama, but neither do I blame the President since by then it's likely that
the Ambassador was already dead. One single blast of gunfire, or even dozens
of blasts, fired an hour or two after it was all over, would have
accomplished absolutely nothing.
AlleyCat
2013-05-15 07:38:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Teabaggers Lie
But, Greg Hicks was the one whose job it was to notify Washington that there
was a problem in the first place, and by his own admission it wasn't until
after his favorite TV show was over that he realized that he'd missed two
phone calls to tell him that the consulate was under siege. I won't blame
Hicks alone, because it was another hour before State and DoD notified
Obama, but neither do I blame the President since by then it's likely that
the Ambassador was already dead. One single blast of gunfire, or even dozens
of blasts, fired an hour or two after it was all over, would have
accomplished absolutely nothing.
All good points, except for the last statement.

It may have been too little, too late, but the argument that everything was too
far away, so we're not going to do anything argument, is ridiculous. The
incident "ran" for how long? What time Zulu did it start? What time could we
have gotten support there? Was Amb. Stevens dead already? If not, a few blasts
of 30mm depleted-uranium rounds WOULD have an effect. Too many unknowns to say
that it's a non-issue, like one of the Obama dick suckers here says. All I want
to know are the facts... not all have been forthcoming, especially the "whys".

Siri absolutely won't discuss the COVER-UP aspect of Benghazi, so I sink to his
level to talk about why it happened and why it could or couldn't be stopped. I
want to discuss the cover-up, but the Obama apologists in this group, deflect
to the inane when the truth upsets them.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-15 08:16:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
It may have been too little, too late, but the argument that everything was too
far away, so we're not going to do anything argument, is ridiculous. The
Everything was too far for the response time they thought they needed.

Given enough time, you can cross any distance at any speed other than zero.
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-15 08:32:47 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 15 May 2013 01:16:37 -0700, In article <chine.bleu-
Post by Siri Cruise
Everything was too far for the response time they thought they needed.
Do you have a time-line, Karnac?

When did the attack begin?

When did they "call" for help?

When did they break in?

When was Amb. Stevens dragged out?

When was he killed?

Are you CERTAIN nothing could have been done, because of time?

Do you have access to Classified Material that depicts the time-line?

Nope.

Quit being so fucking positive with your answers, you really sound stupid. I'm
suggesting they get helped, and you're arguing against it? Why? Is Obama REALLY
that important to you? Get help, loon.

I've just about come to the end. You half-wits are just to indoctrinated and
brain-washed to have an open mind about anything. It's this, or it's nothing at
all. Obama and his minions can do no wrong. Really? Yes... really pathetic.
Teabaggers Lie
2013-05-15 08:20:54 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 13 May 2013 21:54:52 -0600, In article
Post by Teabaggers Lie
But, Greg Hicks was the one whose job it was to notify Washington that there
was a problem in the first place, and by his own admission it wasn't until
after his favorite TV show was over that he realized that he'd missed two
phone calls to tell him that the consulate was under siege. I won't blame
Hicks alone, because it was another hour before State and DoD notified
Obama, but neither do I blame the President since by then it's likely that
the Ambassador was already dead. One single blast of gunfire, or even dozens
of blasts, fired an hour or two after it was all over, would have
accomplished absolutely nothing.
All good points, except for the last statement.
It may have been too little, too late, but the argument that everything was too
far away, so we're not going to do anything argument, is ridiculous. The
incident "ran" for how long?
What time Zulu did it start?
19:42 Zulu
What time could we have gotten support there?
Given that Washington wasn't even notified until 20:32 Zulu, aside from a
few old men like Greg Hicks who were already in-country, certainly not
before 22:00. The type of support you're talking about? 23:00, at best.
Was Amb. Stevens dead already?
In all likelihood, he was dead (or dying) a few minutes after the
conversation he was having with Hicks about the consulate being stormed was
suddenly cut off which was just before Hicks called Washington. So yes, it's
highly probable that he was already dead before Washington heard the news,
or died within minutes after that call to D.C. by Hicks.
If not, a few blasts of 30mm depleted-uranium rounds WOULD
have an effect. Too many unknowns to say that it's a non-issue,
like one of the Obama dick suckers here says. All I want to know
are the facts... not all have been forthcoming, especially the "whys".
Many of the facts that you want to know are probably classified, and
probably for good reason. It's likely we won't have all of the answers to
"why" for several years.
Siri absolutely won't discuss the COVER-UP aspect of Benghazi, so I sink to his
level to talk about why it happened and why it could or couldn't be stopped. I
want to discuss the cover-up, but the Obama apologists in this group, deflect
to the inane when the truth upsets them.
The very fact that you insist that it's a cover-up indicates that you're not
receptive to any answers that don't support that assumption. That's every
bit as much of a deflection to the inane as any comment by any liberal in
here. I prefer to keep an open mind when dealing with questions about issues
where little is both actually known and declassified. That's our status on
ALL of these issues that the right-wingers are claiming are cause for
impeachment. I've always been a proponent of knowing just what I'm shooting
at and aiming before pulling the trigger. Otherwise you might do like Dick
Cheney and shoot your friend in the face . . . or shoot yourself in the
foot.
AlleyCat
2013-05-15 08:37:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Teabaggers Lie
In all likelihood
Aaahng... fail. We're not talking likelihoods here. Come up with a concrete
time-line, then we'll discuss. Happy hunting.

Oh yeah... what do TEA Party Members lie about? Is it anything like what Obama
does on a daily basis? How about NBC?



http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=obama+lies+7+times+in+under+2
+minutes&oq=obama+lies&gs_l=youtube.1.1.35i39j0l9.7260.10546.0.12376.8.6.2.0.0.
0.217.856.1j3j2.6.0...0.0...1ac.1.11.youtube.NhFWzDqCB74

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/19/msnbc-edits-romney-rally-speech-
portrays-candidate-as-out-touch/

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2011/08/16/ed-schultz-edits-rick-
perry-falsely-accuse-him-making-racist-remark-a#ixzz1qv7FzaFJ

http://video.foxnews.com/v/1551844899001/nbc-edits-zimmermans-911-tape/

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/05/03/msnbc-forced-to-apologize-after-
egregiously-taking-quotes-out-of-context-for-gun-control-segment/
Teabaggers Lie
2013-05-15 14:26:13 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 15 May 2013 02:20:54 -0600, In article
Post by Teabaggers Lie
In all likelihood
Aaahng... fail. We're not talking likelihoods here. Come up with a concrete
time-line, then we'll discuss. Happy hunting.
You snipped it, but I gave you a rough timeline, as it's been released and
then corrorborated by Greg Hicks and others that were willing to tell the
uni-partisan investigating committee what they wanted to hear. We know that
the first Washington heard about it was when Greg Hicks called 27 minutes
AFTER his conversation with the ambassador was cut short, which was the last
anybody from our side saw or heard from Stevens. Beyond that nobody can be
certain about anything for the next two and a half hours when the
ambassador's was delivered to a local hospital. He could have been dead at
the moment his call to Hicks was cut short, or he might have died only
moments before his body's arrival at the hospital. But the shooting had
stopped long before that, barely an hour after it started. It's not 100%
certain, but odds are against Stevens still being alive after the shooting
had stopped.

And for your idea of hitting the consulate with a few 30mm rounds from a
hypothetical aircraft that wasn't there, remember that we had no idea just
where Stevens was. If he was still alive and your proposed attack would've
hit him you guys would be screaming even louder that we'd killed our own
ambassador. Let's face it . . . even if Obama had magically personally
appeared on the scene the moment the crowd started to assemble, and then
made the masses happy by feeding hundreds of them using only two fishes and
a loaf of bread you guys would've found fault with him, probably saying he
should have done it with only one fish. You hate Obama so much that no
matter what he does, it's wrong in your eyes.
Oh yeah... what do TEA Party Members lie about? Is it anything like what Obama
does on a daily basis? How about NBC?
Oh, they lie about a lot of things. Start with their very basic claim that
they're overtaxed, when the tax rate was the lowest in modern history when
they started to make that claim, and it's still way below what has been the
norm for decades. Also, they call themselves "patriots", but their most
prominent tactic is attempting to suppress the vote by minorities, which is
certainly not patriotic. They claim they're not racist but have no problems
showing up at their rallies carrying signs with obviously racist slogans.
They try to file for tax exemptions as benevolent charities instead of as
political action groups, which is most certainly what they are. They claim
to be multiple independent "grass roots" organizations with no central
organizational structure or leadership yet they share common spokespeople
and share centralized funding. They claim, at many of their local rallies,
to be strictly local organizations yet they bus "local" members all around
the country to boost participation at rallies to many times what the true
locals could ever muster. They claim to be non-partisan when in reality they
are nothing more than an extension of the right wing of the GOP.

Their whole existence is a lie. They're nothing more than an anti-Obama hate
group.
AlleyCat
2013-05-16 02:09:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Teabaggers Lie
but I gave you a rough timeline
Aahng... wrong! We don't do "rough" here. If you know the EXACT timeline,
please post it, otherwise, please don't use your crystal ball.

"""He could have been dead at
the moment his call to Hicks was cut short, or he might have died only
moments before his body's arrival at the hospital. But the shooting had
stopped long before that, barely an hour after it started. It's not 100%
certain, but odds are against Stevens still being alive after the shooting
had stopped.""""

So we just say, "Oh well... it's over... nothing we can do for Amb. Stevens,
so let's just go back to bed and worry about it in the morning, and come up
with some kind of excuse for not sending anyone."

I don't buy it... that's why we have commissions. It may take longer than
Obama will be in office, to find out what all happened, but I can wait.

""""remember that we had no idea just
where Stevens was."""

We know where the consulate is, and that's where Obama's brothers were.

"""If he was still alive and your proposed attack would've
hit him you guys would be screaming even louder that we'd killed our own
ambassador..."""

Ever hear of night vision goggles and helmets? They wouldn't have had to blast
the place to smithreens. A few well placed rounds is enough. Obama's brothers
in the B'hood, KNOW the sound all too well. Roaches would have split.

""""Let's face it . . . even if Obama had magically personally
appeared on the scene the moment the crowd started to assemble, and then
made the masses happy by feeding hundreds of them using only two fishes and
a loaf of bread you guys would've found fault with him, probably saying he
should have done it with only one fish. You hate Obama so much that no
matter what he does, it's wrong in your eyes.""""

Reducio ad absurdum...

I do NOT hate Obama... decent man, but a terrible "leader". Is it any wonder
he in charge of the most corrupt administration to date?
Teabaggers Lie
2013-05-16 07:45:12 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 15 May 2013 08:26:13 -0600, In article
Post by Teabaggers Lie
but I gave you a rough timeline
Aahng... wrong! We don't do "rough" here. If you know the EXACT timeline,
please post it, otherwise, please don't use your crystal ball.
Why not? That's what you're expecting of the Obama Administration.
"""He could have been dead at
the moment his call to Hicks was cut short, or he might have died only
moments before his body's arrival at the hospital. But the shooting had
stopped long before that, barely an hour after it started. It's not 100%
certain, but odds are against Stevens still being alive after the shooting
had stopped.""""
So we just say, "Oh well... it's over... nothing we can do for Amb. Stevens,
so let's just go back to bed and worry about it in the morning, and come up
with some kind of excuse for not sending anyone."
Not a good solution, but a better one than sending in the jets to bomb a
compound after the insurgents were already gone.
I don't buy it... that's why we have commissions. It may take longer than
Obama will be in office, to find out what all happened, but I can wait.
You'll probably have to wait until Hell freezes over. To quote former
Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, "As we know, there are known knowns.
There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns.
That is to say, we know there are some things we do not know. But there are
also unknown unknowns; the ones we don't know we don't know."

There are facts here that remain forever in the category of "some things we
do not know". Know what I mean?
""""remember that we had no idea just
where Stevens was."""
We know where the consulate is, and that's where Obama's brothers were.
By the time a jet could've gotten there? No, they (and they're most
certainly NOT "Obama's brothers") were already gone. Once again, you've
snipped out the "known" timing data, but the whole episode was over quickly
and the mob was gone, along with the ambassador.
"""If he was still alive and your proposed attack would've
hit him you guys would be screaming even louder that we'd killed our own
ambassador..."""
Ever hear of night vision goggles and helmets? They wouldn't have had to blast
the place to smithreens. A few well placed rounds is enough. Obama's brothers
in the B'hood, KNOW the sound all too well. Roaches would have split.
So, now you're talking about a team of combat ground troops? Within an hour
of Washington getting the call? You must think our military has some sort of
secret teleportation device to move troops and weapons instantly from any
place in the world to a hot spot in the wink of an eye. I thought you were
more rational than that.
""""Let's face it . . . even if Obama had magically personally
appeared on the scene the moment the crowd started to assemble, and then
made the masses happy by feeding hundreds of them using only two fishes and
a loaf of bread you guys would've found fault with him, probably saying he
should have done it with only one fish. You hate Obama so much that no
matter what he does, it's wrong in your eyes.""""
Reducio ad absurdum...
I do NOT hate Obama... decent man, but a terrible "leader". Is it any wonder
he in charge of the most corrupt administration to date?
Your hatred is showing again. This is FAR from the "most corrupt
administration to date". Even if the wildest speculations of the most rabid
right-wing pundits . . . I think that would be Michael "Savage" Wiener . . .
the level of corruption falls short of the Bush 43 Administration (the lies
to take us to war in Iraq and the treasonous outing of covert CIA Agent
Valerie Plame), short of the Reagan Administration (Iran/Contra) and FAR
short of the Nixon Administration (Watergate, FBI and IRS used to compile an
"Enemies List" and warrantless wiretapping of left-leaning groups).
Teabaggers Lie
2013-05-12 06:12:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
I'd be willing to pay an extra 2% if we could get the billionaires to do the
same.

What part of "one of the lowest tax rates in history" don't YOU understand?
Loading Image...

What's ironic is that Republicans keep claiming that cutting taxes is the
path to prosperity, but if you overlay a graph of adjusted GDP on top of a
graph of the marginal tax rate GDP typically goes up when taxes go up and
goes down when taxes are cut.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-12 06:14:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Teabaggers Lie
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
I'd be willing to pay an extra 2% if we could get the billionaires to do the
same.
What part of "one of the lowest tax rates in history" don't YOU understand?
http://markmaynard.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/taxthresh3.png
What's ironic is that Republicans keep claiming that cutting taxes is the
path to prosperity, but if you overlay a graph of adjusted GDP on top of a
graph of the marginal tax rate GDP typically goes up when taxes go up and
goes down when taxes are cut.
Facts are stubborn things.
--
In the Battlefield Earth sequel, daddy will be ancient spy who is unfrozen
to keep Teri's gold member from being stolen from Fort Knox.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 08:08:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Teabaggers Lie
I'd be willing to pay an extra 2% if we could get the billionaires to
do the same.
It's been proven that that would solve very little, moron.

You just got a 2% tax rate hike. Want even more?

Hmmm? 2% of 1 billion. How many "billionaires" are there?

Might pay for the Atlanta crack whore's fixes. Maybe hers:


FirstPost
2013-05-12 13:40:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Teabaggers Lie
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
I'd be willing to pay an extra 2% if we could get the billionaires to do the
same.
So you're willing to levy that tax on over 99% of the population just
so you can squeeze a few more pennies out of less than 1000 citizens
that you are simply jealous as hell of.
Anything else ya got to show just what a simple minded liberal idiot
you are dumbass?
Post by Teabaggers Lie
What part of "one of the lowest tax rates in history" don't YOU understand?
http://markmaynard.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/taxthresh3.png
What's ironic is that Republicans keep claiming that cutting taxes is the
path to prosperity, but if you overlay a graph of adjusted GDP on top of a
graph of the marginal tax rate GDP typically goes up when taxes go up and
goes down when taxes are cut.
opel
2013-05-12 17:13:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Teabaggers Lie
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
I'd be willing to pay an extra 2%
No one cares, fuck off.
Siri Cruise
2013-05-13 00:26:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Teabaggers Lie
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
I'd be willing to pay an extra 2%
No one cares, fuck off.
Aye, aye, Miss Kadett.
--
Pscyhlos do not explode when the sunlight hits them. I don't care how
crazy they are.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
Teabaggers Lie
2013-05-13 00:44:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Teabaggers Lie
Post by AlleyCat
On Sat, 11 May 2013 21:28:55 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmmd6m$ftl$27
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Do you want MORE taxes? Simple question.
I'd be willing to pay an extra 2%
No one cares, fuck off.
AlleyCat asked the question. I gave the answer. If you don't care, that's
fine, but that means that YOU'RE the one who needs to "fuck off". Not me.
opel
2013-05-14 04:01:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Teabaggers Lie
OU'RE the one who needs to "fuck off". Not me.
You need to die very very soon, trust me on this.
Teabaggers Lie
2013-05-14 04:08:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Teabaggers Lie
OU'RE the one who needs to "fuck off". Not me.
You need to die very very soon, trust me on this.
Is that a threat loser?
Mr. B1ack
2013-05-12 02:34:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
May 11, 2013
Does the Tea Party understand the Constitution?
At least as well as yer average 'liberal' :-)
Zepp
2013-05-12 03:06:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mr. B1ack
May 11, 2013 Does the Tea Party understand the Constitution?
At least as well as yer average 'liberal' :-)
Most teabagger seem to think they have the right to ban people from
voting because of their religion. You ok with that?
opel
2013-05-12 03:54:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Most teabagger seem to think
You're sounding drunker...
AlleyCat
2013-05-12 04:24:30 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:06:38 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmn0vu$uea$11
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Most teabagger seem to think they have the right to ban people from
voting because of their religion. You ok with that?
I find it amusing that you call TEA Party members, "Teabaggers", when
it's the liberal gay boys that enjoy that kind of thing. Aren't YOU a
liberal?

Who said anything about banning anyone from voting? What religion?
Please cite any reference to that, please.
Teabaggers Lie
2013-05-12 23:55:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by AlleyCat
On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:06:38 +0000 (UTC), In article <kmn0vu$uea$11
@dont-email.me>, ***@gone.com says...
Post by Zepp
Most teabagger seem to think they have the right to ban people from
voting because of their religion. You ok with that?
I find it amusing that you call TEA Party members, "Teabaggers", when
it's the liberal gay boys that enjoy that kind of thing. Aren't YOU a
liberal?
Would you prefer that we call you Tea Party Cowards or Tea Party Traitors?
Or perhaps Tea Party Bigots is most appropriate. The word "patriot"
certainly doesn't fit anywhere into what the Tea Party stands for.
Post by AlleyCat
Who said anything about banning anyone from voting? What religion?
Please cite any reference to that, please.
I don't know about any religious group being harassed when trying to vote,
but I've seen lots of reports where Tea Party groups were harassing
Hispanics who were trying to vote, intimidating them with snarling dogs on
short leashes while the potential voters were waiting in line to vote, and
demanding to see their "papers", just like Hitler's Nazis. The ironic part
is that most of the Hispanics these loons were trying to intimidate can
trace their families' roots completely locally to the 1500's. Hispanic
families that have lived right here in New Mexico for 11 or 12 generations
have been accosted by these Tea Party storm troopers and accused of being
illegal aliens. What a joke! The families of the accusers themselves have
generally been here only a fraction of that time, but to them all Hispanics
are undesirables.
opel
2013-05-14 04:53:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Teabaggers Lie
Would you prefer that we call you Tea Party Cowards or Tea Party Traitors?
I'd prefer seeing a nice new hatchet in your forehead, personally
speaking of course...
Teabaggers Lie
2013-05-14 04:59:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by opel
Post by Teabaggers Lie
Would you prefer that we call you Tea Party Cowards or Tea Party Traitors?
I'd prefer seeing a nice new hatchet in your forehead, personally
speaking of course...
Oh, you are SO good at this "rational discourse" thing.
Mr. B1ack
2013-05-12 06:37:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Post by Mr. B1ack
May 11, 2013 Does the Tea Party understand the Constitution?
At least as well as yer average 'liberal' :-)
Most teabagger seem to think they have the right to ban people from
voting because of their religion. You ok with that?
Never once heard any 'T' say that.

Are you putting words in their mouths now ?
Zepp
2013-05-12 15:45:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mr. B1ack
Post by Zepp
Post by Mr. B1ack
May 11, 2013 Does the Tea Party understand the Constitution?
At least as well as yer average 'liberal' :-)
Most teabagger seem to think they have the right to ban people from
voting because of their religion. You ok with that?
Never once heard any 'T' say that.
Are you putting words in their mouths now ?
Nope. Ask them about "Moozlims" voting.
opel
2013-05-12 17:33:25 UTC
Permalink
On 5/12/2013 9:45 AM, Zepp

= http://thehumanist.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/Jamieson-1.jpg

...fat, fluffy-necked, canuckleheaded ex-pat trash.
Steve
2013-05-12 10:23:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
Post by Mr. B1ack
May 11, 2013 Does the Tea Party understand the Constitution?
At least as well as yer average 'liberal' :-)
Most teabagger seem to think they have the right to ban people from
voting because of their religion. You ok with that?
Zepp can really make up wild eyed stories, can't he?

"Electricity in California was a publically-held utility (i.e.,
government-run) from 1895 until 1998. It took privatization
of the generation plants to fuck everything up
beyond belief."
David (Zepp) Jamieson
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.republicans/msg/3ad9a56512ac8e2e?hl=en
Steve
2013-05-12 11:02:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zepp
May 11, 2013
Does the Tea Party understand the Constitution?
Better than Zepp, anyway.. See below:


Here's another stupid claim from Zepp about the
Constitution.

"Incidently, the fact that the Constitution
specifies that people have right to vote in a
presidential election pretty much takes the choice of
having [a presidential election] out of the hands of
the states."
--David B.(Zepp) Jamieson Sun, Sep 3 2006
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.society.liberalism/msg/efb4fcac7b1561cb?hl=en&

...
Post by Zepp
Canyon note> Today, Electors are chosen by popular
election, but the Constitution does not mandate a
popular election. The 14th Amendment does mention the
choosing of Electors, but is relevant only when
Electors are elected by popular vote. There is
similar mention in the 24th Amendment. In other
words, Electors could be appointed by a state's
legislature, or the legislature could empower the
governor to choose electors. In some cases, state
law allows for such appointments if the popular
vote cannot be used to determine a winner, such
as if election results are contested up to
federally-mandated deadlines.
http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_elec.html
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